• At wits end original post as eaten by the servers

    1397846562
    Mr Frustration [sign in to see picture]
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    Hi all

    I’ve shopped at LH a couple of times so that’s why I’m here. This forum looks really helpful. Sorry for this long post.

    OK here goes. We’ve been married 32 years and my wife sexually has never been in the slightest aroused. She’s disgusted by fluids, genitals, and has never felt any form of sexual pleasure at all. We do manage intercourse reasonably OK because she enjoys the ‘cuddle’. We’ve had advice, sex therapy, viewed self-help videos, etc.. The result is she now allows clitoris stimulation and at last the condoms have gone. As for anything more adventurous – the answer is no. However, nothing - I repeat - nothing gives her any sensation, apart from Lovehoney’s ferocious little vibrator and even then she does not like the feeling.  Any form of gentle massage from body to genitals does abolutely nothing.

    She has absolutely no sense of fantasy, sensuality or sexual enjoyment. It’s like the nerves are cut to her loins or her sexuality is absent. I asked her if she is asexual but she insists she is not.

    I’ve exhausted every last cent in my knowledge to help her relax and try to enjoy sex but to no avail. If I massage her clitoris simply nothing happens until she tells me to stop.  Worse, it’s a tiny thing that is virtually impossible to massage. She won’t allow me to look, so I can’t even see what I am doing! 

    So, here are my questions:

    1. Have any of you 100% fail-safe ideas for getting a small, dead clitoris to respond? Remember  I have read a lot and tried, but people’s experience might help further

    2. Have you any great ideas that might help me unlock my wife from her kind of ‘sex happens to other people’ viewpoint?

    3. If no ideas for me – are there words you can say that I can e-mail on to her to let her see how other people (women only, please) view this?

    4. I know this sounds mad, perverse, but I wondered if a sex coach (as opposed to a therapist) could teach me the skills I need? Does anyone know if this is a good way forward and if there are any in the South East UK? This might be out of my depth.

    Some people will say ‘leave her’ but I am not going to leave the woman I love after 32 years and a great partnership between us. We have a lot working well between us. Our relationship is strong and the only crippled bit is the sex.

    My most desperate need is to bring her to a great orgasm that will open her eyes to what she has been missing. 

    In advance, my sincerest thanks.

    1397847366
    Jazzam [sign in to see picture]
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    Awh I really want to give you a hug, it's nice to see someone so committed to something that is potentially heartbreaking for you I'm sure x

    I'm sorry I can't really help you that much but wanted to share some support and hope.

    The important thing to remember is that if this is who she is and has always been then this for her is normal, have you I presumed discussed her past with therapists - we are often brought up to think sex is dirty or that it is only for making children and once that is done you should no longer engage in such an act. Of course we know that sex is so much more than that, but everyone must realise what they want from it on their own terms x

    Hopefully one of the more experienced members can give you some actual advice for dealing with this.
    You could also perhaps show her little bits of the conversations (and other threads) so that she can see the support but also the range of normal and not normal x

    1397847554
    Sum Sub [sign in to see picture]
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    That's quite a comprehensive situation you've got going on there.

    I'll give you my thoughts, which may or may not be relevant.

    I think your wife's non-interest in sexual activity and unresponsive clit are most likely not unrelated.

    In my experience, a state of sexual arousal is essential for my OH to enjoy any clit play, and that brings me really to the point you need to address first - how to get her interested.  If she isnt interested it just isn't going to happen.

    There are many threads on here on how to get your OH interested in things, and I know you've said you've read and tried, so maybe a sex coach is the way forward.  You're in the south east so London is on your doorstep, there must be people there who do that kind of service. 

    For my advice...

    Can you talk through it with her, I assume after 30+ years of marriage you know each other pretty well, can you talk to her, get her involved in choosing toys from Lovehoney, talking about them trying to pique her interest, and then when they arrive, just sit together and talk about it, feel it, try it on your nose, let things progress.  What I suppose I'm trying to say is that it should be natural, and yeah you may have one thing in mind, but if you can be natural and just let it get there with minimal coercion, then you have a better chance of her joining you in being excited.

    This isn't going to happen overnight, but stick at it and keep trying, and learn to laugh at the mishaps instead of them getting between you.  

    1397847893
    kittencub [sign in to see picture]
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    Well done for asking now this is going to sound weird drop the orgasm bit, for a while find out if there is anything she likes if she has no fantasies or even books to read it's going to be harder. Has she never said "Oh he's nice on tv " at least you she likes something.how is she regarding toys, pretty nightwear. Nothing to over the top at this stage Sorry not much help am I its going to be tiny steps at this stage.  Does she feel sex is a chore I hated it with my ex,  You may have just say one day I love and want to show you that,. Sorry think I've said enough good luck.

    1397848388
    suzi69 [sign in to see picture]
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    I had the same prob I talked to Dr I  was having crap heavy periods i went through lots of visits in the end I saw a  Dr at hospital he said I needs a hysterectomy I was frighten but it was the best thing m y line so has come back after 5 months and my clit ismuch better I need lots lube I sit up between my hubby legs get comfy and I slowly play around the clit but not on it my hubby rubs my nipples keeping them wet all the time I find using a bullet vib helps .hang in there and try n o t to blame each other it will happen just take it easy  suzi

    1397850897
    MrsMcX [sign in to see picture]
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    I think it's really nice that you're going to such an effort to please your wife, I don't know if I can be much help but I thought I should at least try.

    I personally find that arousal is very much in the mind for a woman. I've found that sometimes my clitoris doesn't respond, sometimes when I'm unwell, or when I just can't seem to get in the mood my clitoris just won't respond because my mind isn't in it. I think maybe you need to try and get your wife to think more erotically. Has she ever read any erotic fiction? Maybe you could get her some books to read over and generally get her mind thinking more about sex.

    Is she generally happy in other aspects of life? Could she be depressed, stressed, or on medication that might affect her? All of these things can affect sex drive, but I presume since you've a therapist they've probably gone over this, so those suggestions probably don't apply.

    Another problem could be she's just thinking about it too much. At this point it's probably become a really negative thing for her. Have you tried having a very relaxing approach to it? Maybe a meal out, a massage, a mini break, spa day? Do you pay her a lot of compliments? Sometimes women get quite down about body image and maybe she just need a few pick-me-ups?

    A sex coach might be a good thing, but is it something that she wants as well? I'm just not sure if added pressure will really help with a situation like this.

    I personally don't think you should leave her at all, you're totally doing the right thing and you've got nothing but good intentions. Communication is paramount, so make sure you talk through this as much as you can, and maybe try and get her to open up more and ask her what she would like you to do with her. She might need to read some erotic fiction to formulate some ideas.

    That's all I think I can suggest really. I hope it helps a little bit, and I hope you manage to find your happiness. Good luck :)

    1397854450
    capricorn13 [sign in to see picture]
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    I would second the erotic fiction approach; nothing too heavy. I started with 50 Shades and as everyone seems to have read it ,and a film is being made, it might be easier to introduce it.

    Good luck, and well done for hanging in there for so long.

    1397854685
    kinkyqueen [sign in to see picture]
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    I totally agree with MrsMcX, the only thing I would like to add is for your wife to be reassured that she is not alone nor unusual in the way she feels.  But I would like her to know that things can change and not to give up hope of a better and more fulfilling sex life. 

    I have been married nearly 40 years and had very similiar attitudes and problems, in the beginning.  I can honestly say that it has taken me up until a couple of years ago to fully overcome all these negative thoughts and feelings about sex.  I never felt aroused, whatever my lovely husband tried.  I felt the same way about bodily fluids, and had problems relaxing enough to even allow penetration.  It took me years before I experienced my first orgasm.  But do you know through perseverance I have at last become the very sexual woman my husband always said he knew I was.  It's all in the mind......as MrsMcX says.  For me, finding erotic literature was one breakthrough, watching some porn, helpful to accepting sex as messy and making me want to explore more.  Each step I took and achieved gave me more confidence.  The most important thing I found was the ability to become aroused by giving pleasure to my husband.

    I could go on, but there is some good advice already on here, it's a question of finding what works for her.  I truely hope she gets there one day.

    .

    1397909842
    Mr Frustration [sign in to see picture]
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    Thank you all for your kind words. Erotic fiction seems an interesting approach. She's a great fan of Jodi Picoult and reads some heavy fiction - does anyone know of erotic fiction that is of a similar, solid powerful read?

    1397910333
    MrsMcX [sign in to see picture]
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    Have you tried introducing her to book of the month on lovehoney. You could even get it for her once a month as a gift. You often get a free toy with it, so it's a nice excuse to get her reading a wider range of erotic fiction and also building up a little bit of a toy collection should she wish to use it with you if she takes some steps forwards.

    This book of the month is this -

    http://www.lovehoney.co.uk/product.cfm?p=30487

    And you get this free -

    http://www.lovehoney.co.uk/product.cfm?p=13439

    1397923537
    Fluffbags [sign in to see picture]
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    I agree with MrsMc - as a woman, for most of us, your arousal starts in the mind. You say your wifes clitoris is not responsive and this makes complete sense based on her views of sex overall. The truth is that if us women are not "in the right mood" mentally, then it is very hard to get a physical response either. Its like our mind is able to flip that switch on the clitoris to "responsive" or "not responsive" so my advice would be at first, to avoid trying to find failsafe ways to stimulate her clitoris, because it doesn't matter how amazing you are at it, if she is shutting down her arousal mentally (and it sounds exactly like she is doing this, because as you described what feelings she felt from the vibrator - it was not enjoyable for her.) then nothing will work (as you proved with the vibe)

    Everything you wrote screamed at me that she has some quite deep seated views/issues/fears surrounding sex. It doesn't sound like a little thing, (Like say, not wanting to try anal sex because she thinks that is dirty or wrong) it sounds like quite an all inclusive problem for her. All of sex is not enjoyable.

    I don't think I would recommend a sex coach tbh. I think this is the wrong approach for the following reasons:

    1) Her refusal to become aroused is almost certainly a mental/emotional issue. You cannot "cure" this, only she can cure this by getting help herself (councilling etc)

    2) As already mentioned, I doubt very much it is your sexual technique that is causing this. I am going to assume that learning better techniques to please her physically will not work, because that is not the problem.

    I wouldn't say the coaching was a bad idea in future though, when she feels more responsive to the physical side of sex.

    In all honesty, it does sound like an issue that would benefit from therapy (emotional/mental health type of sexual therapy, rather than physical help) I know you said it has not worked in the past - but it has! Did you not say that it was that that helped her accept skin on skin contact (losing the condoms) and letting you touch her clit? This sounds like an absolutely HUGE step in the right direction and it suggests to me that THIS is the correct path to go on - but she will have to go at it again and again until she feels she has reached a point that she deems comfortable and acceptable. It could be that she already has. (Is she unhappy with things?)

    Anyway, I also recommend, as other have suggested, trying new ways to titilate her mind now, rather than her body (Until her body is responsive) of course, I do not mean stop trying the physical stuff, but I mean don't focus on that until the mental side clicks into place. I recommend erotic fiction too.....but bear in mind, if she already says "sex happens to other people" then she may read it and just not associate herself with what she is reading, or may find it disgusting (as she feels right now)

    I simply recommend more councilling. I think you showed it has worked in the past and it was the only thing that did. Unfortuntely there is no quick fix or foolproof method here.

    Good Luck xxx

    1397924435
    kittencub [sign in to see picture]
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    Erotic fiction, if she likes history novels get her clan of the cave bear by J M Arel  the love scenes are beautifully described in fact even today I consider them very erotic.sex is in the mind for me a lot, crack that and you"re on the way good luck.

    1397924901
    Laveila [sign in to see picture]
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    Hello,

    I can see you frustration. There is something which bit spring into my mind. What sort of background does your wife come from? I assume, given your age, she may not have any real discussion about sex. And if she did, often there is still the tendency to shut women away from pleasure. I remember being pushed into thinking that touching my genitals is wrong, disgusting, something a self-respecting woman would not do. And I think this is still even nowadays a bit of problem for women. And trust me, it DOES have a huge impact. I was in similar situation in the past. My feminine juices were disgusting and no matter how needy I was, I was just refusing to touch myself.

    It did take me some time to get round it. Generally by reading about sex and slowly coming round the idea it is nothing to be ashamed of. At first I was more comfortable with using toy when I started to play, but I now have no problems touching myself. Seeking professional help may be way to solve it.

    So it is possible to have this sorted, because I think its most likely in her mind. But it may take few years to be completely gone, and she HAS to want it. If she decides, she will never change her viewpoint about sex, then she will most likely not.

    good luck.

    1397927962
    Strange Days [sign in to see picture]
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    You have been married for 32 years, with this situation...?? Well, you certainly have tried. So I guess you are both 50 ish. But from what you describe, you have an awful long way to go, to get what you want - and deserve. With no g'tee of success, to be blunt. 

    I sympathise completely - having been in a simlar situation. Shame theres no PM system, or I would tell you more. My 'solution' is ultimately to split up - but there are other issues too.

    You deserve better. All the best.

    1397931239
    scarab9 [sign in to see picture]
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    First, massive respect for obviously caring so much about your wife. One of the most sincere posts I've ever read. Sexlife or not, it sounds like everyone on here could learn something from your relationship.

    Secondly, as usual, Fluffbags comes on with the best answer and advice. Can't imagine how many people she's helped on here!

    My input, this sounds like a psychological issue that's pretty deep. Most likely the 'sex is dirty' influence when young, or possibly a bad event when young. Council appears to have helped and probably would more, but only if she seeks it. Pushing will just make the "you're the one who's wrong" stronger.

    As well as what you re doing I'd suggest concentrating on sensual rather than sexual. Is she happy to be massaged? Go take a class and treat her often and with full attention. Take her to places where she can dress up and feel sexy (I mean nice restaurants or dances, not dungeons here ;-) ). If she feels beautiful, appreciated, loved, and hopefully given time sexy, then that will help massively. Look for quality closeness rather than sex. If it all goes well shell let you know when she wants sex!

    Huge good luck, and I hope to read a post in the future saying how happy you both are and that your sex life is fantastic ;-)

    1397954874
    Case [sign in to see picture]
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    Hi all, this is my first post but I couldn't ignore this. First off big respect for asking for help.

    Okay, I'm not a woman and the issue I had wasn't physical or sexual. But I my mental self and physical self had become disconnected in an emotional way which made me not feel anything towards certain things. I can draw connection with myself and your wife. It is a psychological issue and probably from her formative years. There is hope!

    I underwent a form of psychotherapy called Mind Sight, I know it sounds cheesy, but it actually worked. It has taken me 37 years to feel, to have a full life full of colour and tastes and smells. Maybe this could help your wife? The whole aim is to connect the physical and emotional whilst also creating and strengthening positive synaptic pathways or maps.

    Their is a book that you can buy on it, it can be a bit fluffy at times but is well worth the read. It looks at case studies and how the therapy helped them... Some very successfully some to a lesser degree.

    Anyway it's called Mind Sight, there's a sub title but I can remember it. It's on Amazon and is easily ordered. I'll post a link ASAP.

    Sorry if this seems over the top but I can kind of understand how she must feel.

    All the best.

    Case

    1397957484
    Case [sign in to see picture]
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    I should add that I actually underwent therapy using this technique. I didn't just read the book and sort it out. You should definitely get professional help such as a psychotherapist.

    1397988588
    Laveila [sign in to see picture]
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    I hope you get it sorted, I am just bit worried about her not want further therapy/counselling. the thing which bit worries me, is that she may think she just does not want things to change, that she is "fine" with the way they are. By this I mean that she does not see reason why she should change her view, because deep inside she is operating with what she was taught in the past, most likely when growing up. In  which case, you may not have much luck with changing things and helping her. It must be her, who takes the steps. But she must be willing to try it.

    You may try to lead her into it, maybe relaxing her massage, or having a nice shower together if she is willing. Maybe give her a book which would suit her best. Something more subtle at first? Something bit more romantic, with just bit of sex in it? Not sure what her taste is, I know I hate trully romantic stories as they bore me. But I am pretty sure you will have to be careful with how you pick the book, unless she is ok with reading bit more descriptive scenes.

    I am very sure its psychological problem, most likely resulting from the way she was raised. Unfortunately there is no way to say if it will work and how much time it will take.

    I bit admire you for trying. I think I would likely have ditch the relationship long time ago. While sex is not the most important aspect of the relationship, to be turned down like this by my partner for years... I dont think I could cope.

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    Case [sign in to see picture]
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    Here's the full title and author of the book:

    Mindsight: Transform Your Brain with the New Science of Kindness
    Daniel Siegal (12)

    It's a bit gimmicky in places but overlook that, the practice is sound. I would say that perhaps you could both read the book and then consider more therapy for both of you. A lot of what influence your wife will be you. Like you said, you have a great relationship so if you go through it together then it can only make you stronger.

    I wish you both the best of luck.

    Case

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