Cunnilingus with new partners

I'm a male and always try to play safe, I use condoms for sex and fellatio to protect both me and my partner.  But a number of women that I've been with have asked me to go down on them the first time we had sex, and I know it's risky but I've felt pressured to do it without using a dental dam.

What are the views of women here, do you expect a new partner to go down on you when you first have sex, and would you prefer they didn't use a dental dam?

A friend has suggested asking new partners to take a STD test to ensure they're free from infection, but that seems quite a difficult thing to ask.  How would you feel if a new partner asked you to take a test before they went down on you?

 Personally, I'd see you as someone worth being with rather than just another bloke .

In my personal opinion, life's too short.

Realistically, I wonder what % of female to male STI transmissions come from going down on a girl? I don't imagine it's a particularly significant figure.

I would understand, being tested is very important in a relationship for me, as it means that I can be safe with my partner. But then technically you should not even kiss untested person, as if you have wounds in your mouth, you can still get some STD. Extremely low chances, but the chances are still there, guessing for some STD bigger than for others. Think HIV may be bit low, but hepatitis may have higher chances (yes, hepatitis is also STD, although type A can be easily transmitted by other means too). Also you would have to wait about half a year, as thats how eg. hepatitis B shows up. C is up to 120 days, HIV takes up to 3 months after last sex to get reliable results. Not sure about the other STD, how long it can take to get reliable results. But I think it is always worth to get tested.

JakeH wrote:

In my personal opinion, life's too short.

Realistically, I wonder what % of female to male STI transmissions come from going down on a girl? I don't imagine it's a particularly significant figure.

Chances are far less with oral sex, compared to vaginal sex. the most dangerous is anal sex. Not sure what the chance is, but it is still there. But less women have HIV compared to men - in my country the known cases are about 1300men, 300 or so women. but luck can be bad...And not sure how many men compared to women got tested.

I can't imagine not getting tested between partners. I'm just not going to risk someone's health, especially someone I care about enough to sleep with. I'm just not.

And I really don't care who calls me a prude for it. There is no way an orgasm is worth risking someone's life.

Any discussion such as this with regards cunnilingus and STI's should also consider HPV infections.  I am an oral surgeon and I must inform all of you that there is an EXTREMELY high correlation between throat cancer and HPV.  If you are interested you can certainly read more about this.  I can't emphasize enough what a serious issue this is.

so what do you suggest?

 If you use condoms, and so make a habit of carrying them, why not just carry dental dams aswell and avoid the issue? TBH I've never used a dental dam but since I saw the TV program about how the same virus that gives women uterine cancer also gives men thoat cancer from oral sex (HPV), it did make me think I will next time I have a new partner. 

For some reason the govt have decided not to vaccinate boys because they will automatically be protected if all girls are. Shame it doesn't exactly work like that. There's quite a few STI's you can catch from oral on a girl, HIV and clamidya are low risk but Gonorrhea is quite a high risk. 

I wouldn't be offended or upset if a guy wished to use one with me. I would find it a bit off putting if he wanted sex and head but wasn't prepared to return the favour, that might make me think he would rather take than give. 

mm i know how you fel fun for each ohter is what its has to be but how do you know for sure if it's safe ?

There is a lab test for HPV.  As a matter of fact there is a way for your dentist to do a simple saliva test to see if you are positive for HPV.  You can read more about this by googgling OralDNA laboratory.

The HPV is a bit of problem.Is there any treatment? I believe that we can only treat symtoms such as wards, but we cannot get the HPV out of the system. And I am wondering... I always thought that some types of HPV you can get by other means as well, I know this is certainly true for wards on feet and hand? Are those different types of HPV compared to those, that cause oral and cervical cancer? Because those had in my school year about 75-80% of people at least once in their lives. Some even as young as age of 4.

hornster wrote:

Drtoast wrote:

Any discussion such as this with regards cunnilingus and STI's should also consider HPV infections.  I am an oral surgeon and I must inform all of you that there is an EXTREMELY high correlation between throat cancer and HPV.  If you are interested you can certainly read more about this.  I can't emphasize enough what a serious issue this is.

Apologies if this is a silly question, but what is HPV?

H

Human papilomavirus. Basically there are over 100 of them, they are highly infectious, large percentage of population is basically infected or was infected at certain point of their lives, some are relatively harmless. Generally the body can deal with them, but they can cause warts (had those few years ago on my feet) on feet, hands, face or genital area. And some are the known cause for cervical and throat cancer. As far as I know there is no way to get the HPV out of your body, we are only able to treat the symptons, such as warts or cervical cancer. The vaccination prevents you from getting few of these, but not sure how certain this is. Generally vaccinations are not 100% successful. I know that eg. the vaccination for hepatitis A has only about 80-85% success rate (we have this type at work and I was told this because of prevention messure).

Personally, I wouldn't expect anything the first time I have sex with a new partner, except sex, I suppose. But oral is something I am not a huge fan of anyway. I used to think it was great, but because my man doesn't enjoy it and I don't like his beard on me, I don't miss it at all really.

If somebody said that it couldn't happen without protection, then I would always respect their wishes. Not fair to pressure someone in that position (pardon the pun) and I would be quite happy to have an STI check if I thought it was to be reasonably serious with us and if he were to have an STI check too. (Why would it only be me having the check when it takes two to tango - as it were..)

I am allergic to condoms, so it would be essential for us to both get checks at the start of the relationship, I suppose.

In my wild days, I actually caught Gonnoreahea from oral sex alone with a man. So I suppose the risk would be just as high for women to spread an infection in a similar way.

Yes, there are in fact many varieties of teh HPV virus.  With regards to oral-throat cancer there are a couple of varieties, namely HPV-16 which seem to be most often associated with this form of CA.  How we acquire the HPV virus and whether it can eventually clear our bodies is still not well understood.  By the way, the most noticeable manifestation of the HPV virus, namely warts is NOT the one to be concerned with.  Unfortunatley, the really bad variety is invisible and otherwise asymptomatic.  The only answer is to get tested!! 

I am just wondering if these dangerous HPV can also be transmitted by other means, not just sexual contact? I know that the HPV causing warts can be caught in eg. showers etc, thats where I got it very likely while in Romania. Because if they can, I am wondering to what extent they are only sexual transmitted dissease and to what extend it is otherwise. I remember that when I was still virgin, my friend-a doctor- told me that I cannot count I dont have any changes on my cervix, which gets me wondering. I am not sceptical, just want to know how far we understand the transmission proccess.

oh and I admit I did not know you can get any other test apart from regular screening of the cervix for women. because noone tells you you can. Apparently they only do it when you are having problems, but not before. And if you dont have any problems, you have to pay the test yourself. Which is the same with the other tests, eg. HIV can cost you between 350 to about 2000CZK, depending where, if anonymous or registered (they take your national ID details) and how long you are willing to wait for the results.

However one gets infected with the HPV virus is one issue.  For the major purpose of this conversation, the important thing to understand is that if you do cunnilingus on a woman who has HPV (and she may or may not be aware she has it), you are at risk to become infected yourself.  And then once you have been infected with the HPV virus, you are at HIGH RISK for getting oral-pharyngeal cancer.  Is it really worth the risk??

Drtoast wrote:

However one gets infected with the HPV virus is one issue.  For the major purpose of this conversation, the important thing to understand is that if you do cunnilingus on a woman who has HPV (and she may or may not be aware she has it), you are at risk to become infected yourself.  And then once you have been infected with the HPV virus, you are at HIGH RISK for getting oral-pharyngeal cancer.  Is it really worth the risk??

HPV is common - incredibly common. The Ameican Social Health Association reckons that 75-80% of sexually active Americans will contract the HPV at some point in their life. It's very, very common. To suggest infection means you are at "HIGH RISK for getting oral-pharyngeal cancer" is to underestimate how common HPV is and how rare oral-pharyngeal cancer is.

Likewise - HPV causes almost all cervical cancer cases but that's not to say that every woman infected with HPV will get cervical cancer.

Of course there are risks involved. It's not something I'd personally worry too much about having said that, if a person is worried - and it's not just HPV that's a risk, there are plenty of STIs transmissable by oral sex - then it is absolutely your right to insist on using protection. Your partner doesn't have to oblige - they can choose not to have sex instead, as can you if they don't want to use protection. But ultimately, the decision is yours. You are well within your rights to make that request - and prospective partners should at the very least be respectful even if they respectfully decline the offer of sex. Anyone who pokes fun isn't worth shagging anyway

There's plenty of information out there - have a read, weigh up your options and make a decision. Don't worry about what other people think - it's your sex life and it's your health!

Adx

Alicia D'amore wrote:

Drtoast wrote:

However one gets infected with the HPV virus is one issue.  For the major purpose of this conversation, the important thing to understand is that if you do cunnilingus on a woman who has HPV (and she may or may not be aware she has it), you are at risk to become infected yourself.  And then once you have been infected with the HPV virus, you are at HIGH RISK for getting oral-pharyngeal cancer.  Is it really worth the risk??

HPV is common - incredibly common. The Ameican Social Health Association reckons that 75-80% of sexually active Americans will contract the HPV at some point in their life. It's very, very common. To suggest infection means you are at "HIGH RISK for getting oral-pharyngeal cancer" is to underestimate how common HPV is and how rare oral-pharyngeal cancer is.

Likewise - HPV causes almost all cervical cancer cases but that's not to say that every woman infected with HPV will get cervical cancer.

Of course there are risks involved. It's not something I'd personally worry too much about having said that, if a person is worried - and it's not just HPV that's a risk, there are plenty of STIs transmissable by oral sex - then it is absolutely your right to insist on using protection. Your partner doesn't have to oblige - they can choose not to have sex instead, as can you if they don't want to use protection. But ultimately, the decision is yours. You are well within your rights to make that request - and prospective partners should at the very least be respectful even if they respectfully decline the offer of sex. Anyone who pokes fun isn't worth shagging anyway

There's plenty of information out there - have a read, weigh up your options and make a decision. Don't worry about what other people think - it's your sex life and it's your health!

Adx

I agree. Just wanted to say that after reading some available statistics, I found out, that the risks are about the same as cervical cancer, or even bit less common, which is a common infection having bad turning up. Basically about 80% of Czech population get infected at one point of their lives, and only relatively few cases turns into throat cancer. It is a risk, for sure. But not that common.I would understand if the partner wanted me tested, or use as much protection as possible though.

I even checked the test and while useful, it is very expensive, not something you can efford to have done regularly.

If a woman gets a jab for HPV, is she protected for life from getting it or just for a while and is she protected from all forms of it?

Whats worrying me is I asked a GP about men getting HPV a few years ago and he said they can't!  So just to check, can men get a protective jab as well and will they be protected from all dangerous forms of HPV or just some as well?