• Mens´ opinions?

    1295743996
    Ecksvie [sign in to see picture]
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    david doe wrote:

    I think some of the replies are a bit harsh on the guy , maybe he'd just had a shit week ,he was ,tired stressed himself out ,money problems ? .and all he wanted was some nice love making with cuddles more important than orgasms. We all get in moods even women !

    Double D

    That's never an excuse to completely bash a woman's self esteem.

    1295746438
    Mr Monster [sign in to see picture]
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    Much as I'd like to join in the man-bashing (yes he was very wrong to say those things), let's look at the situation - he's tired and stressed, and his lover has been busy for a while (I assume!) with her deadline. He also seems to get most of his sex education from porn movies; there's a big issue with that alone!

    While I agree you should address the emotional outburst, maybe you could work together on his sexual awareness. You may not have signed up for the job, but he desperately needs some education. Maybe you could introduce him to some of the things that you enjoy, either in bed, or movies, erotic literature, and explain what turns you on about them. Emphasise that it's not about an all-powerful magic penis that can single-handedly (hands-free?) stimulate every erogenous zone (explain where these are!) and then make you a cup of tea afterwards. I'm guessing you two aren't particularly in to using other toys either? Why not try introducing something that he finds erotic... once he's comfortable with the idea of using something in the bedroom, he shouldn't see your using toys with him as a threat or an insult.

    1295747579
    Alicia D'amore [sign in to see picture]
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    Mr Monster wrote:

    Much as I'd like to join in the man-bashing (yes he was very wrong to say those things), let's look at the situation - he's tired and stressed, and his lover has been busy for a while (I assume!) with her deadline. He also seems to get most of his sex education from porn movies; there's a big issue with that alone!

    While I agree you should address the emotional outburst, maybe you could work together on his sexual awareness. You may not have signed up for the job, but he desperately needs some education.

    Just so you know - I did say exactly that

    If he shows remorse over being downright nasty then yeah, work together and improve the matter teach him the joys of sex toys - I'm definitely pro-education - but it doesn't change that his response was completely unacceptable whether about sex toys or breakfast. Regardless tiredness and feeling neglected is no excuse for nastiness

    I just want to clarify my points because I'm aware I'm the strongest "man basher" in the thread but I feel it's important not to accept childish behaviour like that.

    If that can be forgiven, him being insecure about sex toys is minor really, he can be educated and eventually get as much joy from it as the rest of us

    Adx

    1295751404
    Mr Monster [sign in to see picture]
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    Alicia D'amore wrote:

    ....tiredness and feeling neglected is no excuse for nastiness

    I just want to clarify my points because I'm aware I'm the strongest "man basher" in the thread but I feel it's important not to accept childish behaviour like that.

    We all react under stress in different ways. Are you saying that, say, breaking down in tears and curling up in a ball is an "acceptable" response?

    When the person has about as much control over that reaction as they would over an angry, hurtful outburst (i.e. none) but does no harm, I'm sure everyone would be full of nothing but sympathy and we'd all be going "poor bloke, wonder what upset him so much". But because his emotional state manifested itself in a more aggressive hormonal response (ye olde fight-or-flight again!) which then drew on his own mis-conceptions about sex, women, toys, penes, and his own place at the centre of a private porn flick, he's been cast as some kind of raging Neanderthal to be pitied or feared, or worse as a child unable to contain his anger at the smallest of things.

    Just because it's a small thing to the worldly-wise sexperts on here, and just because most of you couldn't contemplate breaking down in the same way, doesn't mean he's failed as a person. He's just a different kind of person, with a different life. The very fact that he's not always like this indicates that he knows it's not acceptable behaviour, but obviously he's been struggling to reconcile his own opinions about sex with the reality he faces in this relationship. Friends with Benefits is a hard balance to get right, and maybe his reasons for wanting this type of sex life are very different from the OP's. Have the two of you talked about what exactly you both want from this relationship? If you're not getting what you really need from him, is he getting what he needs?

    Talk to him, don't accuse him, and allow him to see what his outburst really meant to you. Then talk to him some more. I agree, though, that if he is unwilling to reconsider his assumptions about sex or to commit to changing his behaviour in future (with anger management classes if necessary!) then you should really think twice about continuing in a situation where you're not happy.

    All the best,

    MrMr

    1295751892
    Alicia D'amore [sign in to see picture]
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    Mr Monster wrote:

    Alicia D'amore wrote:

    ....tiredness and feeling neglected is no excuse for nastiness

    I just want to clarify my points because I'm aware I'm the strongest "man basher" in the thread but I feel it's important not to accept childish behaviour like that.

    We all react under stress in different ways. Are you saying that, say, breaking down in tears and curling up in a ball is an "acceptable" response?

    More acceptable than saying something malicious to someone else.

    By a long shot.

    My insecurities are *my* problem, my issues are *my* problem. I can ask WandA to help me but I don't expect it and I certainly do everything I can to not affect him detrimentally when I'm going through a rough patch.

    I don't agree that people saying deliberately hurtful things as a response to stress aren't capable of censoring that. Some aren't but they're a minority. The majority know full well they can deal with it without bein nasty and lashing out. If you wouldn't say it to a stranger/boss when you were just as stressed, why the hell should it be excused as "stress" when said to a partner!

    I just can't accept that stress = out of control of your actions. Some people are out of control of their actions...for the majority, there's no excuse and excusing behaviour like that just means it's likely to happen again.

    Adx

    1295751977
    Alicia D'amore [sign in to see picture]
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    And I mean it's a small thing in the bigger picture it's more important to nip the nastiness in the bud in my opinion. Because it'll help noone if a cycle of arguments, nastiness, hurt and increased insecurities begin just from one or the other knowing they can get away with it and the other resorting to that to "keep up".

    Adx

    1295753076
    Mr Monster [sign in to see picture]
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    Alicia D'amore wrote:

    it's more important to nip the nastiness in the bud in my opinion. Because it'll help noone if a cycle of arguments, nastiness, hurt and increased insecurities begin

    Believe it or not, that's why I jumped in and tried to bring a little balance to the force. The nastiness and insecurities were'nt within the relationship, but they were there sure enough.

    1295753398
    Alicia D'amore [sign in to see picture]
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    Mr Monster wrote:

    Alicia D'amore wrote:

    it's more important to nip the nastiness in the bud in my opinion. Because it'll help noone if a cycle of arguments, nastiness, hurt and increased insecurities begin

    Believe it or not, that's why I jumped in and tried to bring a little balance to the force. The nastiness and insecurities were'nt within the relationship, but they were there sure enough.

    But my point is, he made a choice to bring them into the relationship and therefore has to deal with the consequences of hurting his partner.

    I'm not saying he needs binning or screaming at - but he needs to realise he reacted very badly and *he* is responsible for that.

    I also felt confident I could be quite strong with my comments because I know the OP 1) won't just do what a bunch of forum members tell her too (not that I've given any advice on what to do apart from the letter - merely expressed my opinion on the situation) and 2) is already feeling very hurt and imo needed reminding that she is not in the wrong - he is. And she can deal with it accordingly depending on how she sees fit (and hopefully based on the level of maturity he expresses once he's calmed down)

    I'm not saying we don't all get stressed and lash out from time to time, but if he thinks that behaviour is acceptable than it's very different to just being insecure and apologising for the poor response after the fact.

    It all depends on whether he deserves the "coaxing" and that is something only the OP will know

    If he geniunely stands by his "no man will ever want to fuck you if you use sex toys" statement, then frankly, imo, he's not worth the effort in educating him and he probably won't appreciate it either.

    Adx

    1295754156
    Mr Monster [sign in to see picture]
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    Alicia D'amore wrote:

    If you wouldn't say it to a stranger/boss when you were just as stressed, why the hell should it be excused as "stress" when said to a partner!

    Good points, but I have two responses to this bit -

    1) who says he wouldn't? I have said hideously untactful things to other people when under stress. Maybe that's why I keep getting fired...

    2) who says anyone else can stress him as much as this relationship and this lifestyle? Maybe he never has to deal with anything else that winds him up as much. Certainly there can be nothing as personal and intimate as a sexual relationship, so that's bound to irritate the parts other problems can't reach...

    1295755109
    Alicia D'amore [sign in to see picture]
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    Mr Monster wrote:

    Alicia D'amore wrote:

    If you wouldn't say it to a stranger/boss when you were just as stressed, why the hell should it be excused as "stress" when said to a partner!

    Good points, but I have two responses to this bit -

    1) who says he wouldn't? I have said hideously untactful things to other people when under stress. Maybe that's why I keep getting fired...

    2) who says anyone else can stress him as much as this relationship and this lifestyle? Maybe he never has to deal with anything else that winds him up as much. Certainly there can be nothing as personal and intimate as a sexual relationship, so that's bound to irritate the parts other problems can't reach...

    Your more likely to be in the group of exceptions lovely - you deal with a hell of a lot and I'm sure you've told me only a fraction.

    The majority of people wouldn't behave like that with their boss and certainly not with a stranger - they can control it - if he's one of the minority then fair enough (though I've mentioned tact a fair bit already when discussing the matter) deal with it with some sensitivity. But if he's in the majority who can control it, he's just being lazy/selfish/thoughtless by not trying to control his temper.

    I still stand by my statements though - his insecurities are not the OP's resposnsibility...just like my joint issues aren't WandA's - he chooses to help me because he loves me and is committed to me but I would never expect him to and it's not his responsibility to. As a result, I do everything in my power to avoid negatively affecting him with it - by avoiding complaining and avoiding snapping/lashing out. It's impossible to be perfectly calm all the time but I'd never resort to name calling just because I was stressed. It's not his fault I'm stressed and it's not his fault I don't deal well with stress so why should I make it his problem?

    I am *not* in any way saying that people with depression/anger issues whatever should just "get on with it" and I hope it doesn't come across that way, but the OP has in no way indicated any kind of medical issue. Just a man who lashed out because he felt threatened. Not acceptable in my mind.

    Adx

    1295770635
    healerwhore [sign in to see picture]
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    Hey, I agree with a lot of what MrMr and Ad have both said, especially the bit Ad said about writing stuff down in a letter...things like that can be very useful to some people ( myself included ) to say what you mean to say when it's difficult. And this appears to be a very difficult situation.

    My main worry from your last post Laveila is that you're blaming yourself? Let's get this straight, it's not your fault at all that he reacted like that. His reactions were his own and entirely wrong and I can't ever say that he was right to behave like that. All I meant to say in my previous post was to try and have a little understanding about why he behaved so abnormally. To me the situation you are in seems largely to be about understanding, mostly his of your needs but just a little from you. Whatever you do, you can't blame yourself or take what he insultingly said as something true. He lashed out in anger cos of his own insecurities about being unable to make you cum himself. That's not to say he's a bad guy, but he clearly needs help so he can learn and become a better guy in the future. I also wouldn't go blaming him, pointing the finger never helps anyone, it's a childish response in itself and only ends up making people feel bad.

    1295771535
    Muz333 [sign in to see picture]
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    sospiri wrote:

    That's pretty unanimous that it's OK to use toys to help you orgasm. I'm male and I'd go along with that 100%. By not doing so he's also missing an awful lot of fun and horny mental stimulation. There, that's put it the nice way.

    Now, shooting straight from the hip, he needs to grow up and get himself a sexual education!

    As much as we all agree with this you have to remember that us forum goers tend to be more sexually liberal than the average person anyway. I think a few of my male friends would have issues with toys being introduced during sex but I doubt they'd cause a big fuss over it. I reckon the guy either felt really insecure or was just venting out from another event that had him wound up, something at work or what have you.

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    Laveila [sign in to see picture]
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    We talked on phone last night, we will meet today to talk about what happened. I wrote notes about what I want to say (so I dont forget anything important, as I bet I will be nervous). We agreed that we will try to deal with this calmly and listen to each other. He sounded sorry, so I think there is hope that we will get over this, although it would require some time. Especially to reestablish the trust and closeness again, if we decide to stay lovers. It is just irony, we were both always open about each other sexuality, so this came out of blue. So I am not sure the reason is him not accepting me the way I am, but there may be some external factors to what happened.

    Well, thanks everyone. I will try my best to handle this with care and tactfulness.

    Mr Monster wrote:


    1) who says he wouldn't? I have said hideously untactful things to other people when under stress. Maybe that's why I keep getting fired...

    I am always trying to express my opinion tactfully, but I am not afraid to say that I disagree or what I think honestly. I am red head so I do have some temper, but I have managed to get it under control most of the time (although it can still show sometimes lol). Have to admit that when I am feeling low I just ask people to leave me alone for a bit, to avoid hurting them. I find that easier to spend an evening/day in solitude than to hurt someone with my words.

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