• Circumicised or not?

    1290569398
    MissManners [sign in to see picture]
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    I had a boyfriend who didn't even know he was circumcised. When I saw his penis for the first time I said "I didn't realize you were Jewish" in a joking way, he looked at me dumbfounded and said "I'm not circumcised" thought he was kidding at first but he really had no idea. I showed him a biology drawing online so he could see what the difference was and he was very surprised. He wasn't from a religious family so I guess his parents asked the doctors to circumcise him as a baby for some other reason. Still, they should have told him when he was older that they did something permanent to his willy, they owed him that I think!

    1290570040
    Mr Monster [sign in to see picture]
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    x X x wrote:

    It's normal in my culture for males to be circumsized.

    And there you have it. It's a cultural thing. Not health or welfare, just doing it because that's the done thing.

    If you aren't circumcised, you can always get it done later in life. If you have it done as a baby, you have that choice taken away. Kind of like piercing toddlers' ears for them.

    I like my son whole and undamaged. Any injury to him is a very big deal to me. I don't think I could choose that for him without a very good reason.

    1290571888
    MissManners [sign in to see picture]
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    Mr Monster wrote:

    x X x wrote:

    It's normal in my culture for males to be circumsized.

    And there you have it. It's a cultural thing. Not health or welfare, just doing it because that's the done thing.

    If you aren't circumcised, you can always get it done later in life. If you have it done as a baby, you have that choice taken away. Kind of like piercing toddlers' ears for them.

    I like my son whole and undamaged. Any injury to him is a very big deal to me. I don't think I could choose that for him without a very good reason.

    I wonder why this has become such an acceptable practice to do to babies. If a parent altered their baby’s body in another permanent way, like giving him or her a tattoo, (even a tiny one) it would horrify people. Maybe it’s also the view (for some people) that babies are accessories that won’t grow up to form their own opinions and preferences. They just assume they’ll be fine with it later on or worse they don’t even think about how their baby will feel about his circumcised penis when he’s older. Frankly I think it’s better to let him choose later on in life, there’s no guarantee how they will feel about it when they grow up so its better to let them decide. But that’s just my opinion. Just curious, what are the non-religious reasons why parents get their babies circumcised? This has always puzzled me.

    1290589007
    Nymeria [sign in to see picture]
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    There are health benefits as well as risks. Some people choose to do it for the sake of the benefits and not just for religious/cultural reasons.

    Well, As MrM said girls have their ears pierced when young too. That's seen as quite normal.. and it's a permanent alteration. It's done early in life for their benefit so they can be able to wear earrings/accessories when they are old enough to decide.

    I understand how some may have strong beliefs for not wanting to do things like circumcise and pierce ears etc on their kids but I really don't see an issue with things like that.

    I don't see circumcising or piercing my son/daughter will be damaging to them... A lot of things are already decided for a child by the parent. I don't see why anyone would want to do things like circumcision and have any ill-intent (generally). It's quite ignorant to assume so even if you have such strong views for it not to be done.

    I would still want it to be done to my children and with their best interests at heart. Yes, not by their initial consent- but I don't see my children complaining to me about it later on in life... at all. I would explain my reasoning for doing so if needed.

    Ps. I don't and will never view my children as accessories. Ty. I think other forced beliefs and views on a child can be much more damaging to a child mentally and emotionally. It's easy just to think of physical changes as "omg, how can they do that?!" to a child. In the grand scheme of things- I don't see circumcising as an issue.

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    WandA [sign in to see picture]
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    Mr Monster wrote:

    x X x wrote:

    It's normal in my culture for males to be circumsized.

    And there you have it. It's a cultural thing. Not health or welfare, just doing it because that's the done thing.

    If you aren't circumcised, you can always get it done later in life. If you have it done as a baby, you have that choice taken away. Kind of like piercing toddlers' ears for them.

    I like my son whole and undamaged. Any injury to him is a very big deal to me. I don't think I could choose that for him without a very good reason.

    I think in essence it often seems to boil down to the rights of the individual or the rights of the community. As a liberal I don't think anyone but the individual has a right to make such lasting and avoidable alterations. Some people alternatively place a strong emphasis on conforming.

    What rattles me is the difference in opinion between 'FGM' and 'MGM'. Advocates of both give almost exactly the same reasons for doing so...

    1290642438
    InMe [sign in to see picture]
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    I got circumcised at the age of 18 purely because I wasn't tolerated by the doctor till I was that age.. wanted it done since I was about 15 but sensibly had to wait! Nothing to do with religion just wanted it done.

    However if we ever had a little boy (have a daughter already) wouldn't dream of letting anybody near him! Everybody should be given the choice to make for themselves!!

    1290643284
    Alicia D'amore [sign in to see picture]
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    InMe wrote:

    I got circumcised at the age of 18 purely because I wasn't tolerated by the doctor till I was that age.. wanted it done since I was about 15 but sensibly had to wait! Nothing to do with religion just wanted it done.

    However if we ever had a little boy (have a daughter already) wouldn't dream of letting anybody near him! Everybody should be given the choice to make for themselves!!

    Rolling with PK's "like" symbol!

    Adx

    1290645982
    InMe [sign in to see picture]
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    Alicia D'amore wrote:

    InMe wrote:

    I got circumcised at the age of 18 purely because I wasn't tolerated by the doctor till I was that age.. wanted it done since I was about 15 but sensibly had to wait! Nothing to do with religion just wanted it done.

    However if we ever had a little boy (have a daughter already) wouldn't dream of letting anybody near him! Everybody should be given the choice to make for themselves!!

    Rolling with PK's "like" symbol!

    Adx

    You have me confused there AD??

    1290646354
    WandA [sign in to see picture]
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    InMe wrote:

    Alicia D'amore wrote:

    InMe wrote:

    I got circumcised at the age of 18 purely because I wasn't tolerated by the doctor till I was that age.. wanted it done since I was about 15 but sensibly had to wait! Nothing to do with religion just wanted it done.

    However if we ever had a little boy (have a daughter already) wouldn't dream of letting anybody near him! Everybody should be given the choice to make for themselves!!

    Rolling with PK's "like" symbol!

    Adx

    You have me confused there AD??

    I think you made a good point about freedom of choice that Ad liked.

    1290646957
    InMe [sign in to see picture]
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    Oh cool.. yep tis a big decision to make don't see how somebody else can make it for you.. am fairly sure people wouldn't agree to carrying out such things if they knew the pain involved.. I'v heard the argument that the younger you are the less painful it is but am not convinced. Either way it hurts and why people condone hurting kids like that is beyond me!

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    WandA [sign in to see picture]
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    InMe wrote:

    Oh cool.. yep tis a big decision to make don't see how somebody else can make it for you.. am fairly sure people wouldn't agree to carrying out such things if they knew the pain involved.. I'v heard the argument that the younger you are the less painful it is but am not convinced. Either way it hurts and why people condone hurting kids like that is beyond me!

    I find it horrendous that some people refuse to use pain relief.

    I've seen videos of the 'procedure' online and I fail to see how it is any thing but unethical without pain relief, it involves the forcible retraction/scraping of the foreskin fused to the glans even before the actual act of circumcision.

    It really does require much restraint from myself to not get riled up about certain subjects and this is one of them.

    1290652827
    Alicia D'amore [sign in to see picture]
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    Alicia D'amore wrote:

    InMe wrote:

    I got circumcised at the age of 18 purely because I wasn't tolerated by the doctor till I was that age.. wanted it done since I was about 15 but sensibly had to wait! Nothing to do with religion just wanted it done.

    However if we ever had a little boy (have a daughter already) wouldn't dream of letting anybody near him! Everybody should be given the choice to make for themselves!!

    Rolling with PK's "like" symbol!

    Adx

    Sorry - Peachy Keen from these forums has started putting a "thumbs up" to mimic the "like" option on FB. I'm copying :)

    I liked your post :)

    Adx

    1290654041
    Mr Monster [sign in to see picture]
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    x X x wrote:

    There are health benefits as well as risks.

    Yes, I keep hearing that. What are they again?

    x X x wrote:

    Well, As MrM said girls have their ears pierced when young too. That's seen as quite normal.. and it's a permanent alteration. It's done early in life for their benefit so they can be able to wear earrings/accessories when they are old enough to decide.

    In case you hadn't guessed, I really dislike pre-adult piercings too, and for the same reasons. Anyway, if you talk to fans of piercing, they will usually say that they enjoy the piercing itself as well as the wearing of jewellery afterwards. By that logic, aren't parents actually depriving their daughters of a potentially meaningful and enjoyable experience, as well as a rite of passage?

    x X x wrote:

    I don't see why anyone would want to do things like circumcision and have any ill-intent (generally).

    I'm not saying they do. Merely that to blindly follow the habits of others without due consideration for the consequences is dangerous, in and of itself - when one of those consequences is a genuine and irreversible injury to your newborn child, then that due consideration needs to take this into account, and I'm not sure people really think that deeply about it at all.

    x X x wrote:

    I don't see my children complaining to me about it later on in life... at all.

    They probably won't. Even if they do resent it, they probably will never even mention it to you. But there are men who undergo long-term treatment to try to restore lost foreskins, so some people do think they're missing out as adults.

    Yes, other things may damage children more, but for any possible harm you can always come up with a worse example and say, "at least I'm not doing that!" It's unnecessary, mostly, so why do it?

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    Nymeria [sign in to see picture]
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    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circumcision#Medical_aspects - There are conflicting thoughts on this controversial subject.

    Actually, a majority of girls who have had their ears pierced enjoy wearing what they like at a younger age. I'm not talking about those that are a fan of actually having the procedure done. I had guessed you didn't like that either- I wasn't suggesting you did. Just mentioned that point. If they wanted to have it done they can get another.. Nothing is actually taken away from that just the initial consent.

    I'm not "merely following the habit of other without due consideration for the consequences". I will have the best interests of my children at heart and will want these procedures done when they're young. I've thought about all the concepts. You highlight the dangerous and irreversible risks.. If you talk to the Dr and find one that is experiences etc I don't see a real problem with these issues. People don't blindly go for this procedure and not research on the best way of getting it done.

    Yes, it's unnecessary but tbh, I think I'd be doing my children a favour by getting it done early. I don't see how doing these things will harm my children. That's the point.

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    InMe [sign in to see picture]
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    Not even going to try and multi quote on this as my brain isn't upto it.. far too early!

    @ AD.. Ah I mixed up PK for Pixie King's post and got confused.. don't mind me it happens alot.. lol..

    @ WandA.. I'm not sure how anybody could go through that without pain relief.. hence why I can't stand why people think that it is okay carry this out on their kids.

    I had the procudure done under full anesthetic and spent 3 days in hospital afterwards and even with pain killers it hurt.. walking was uncomfortable and if it touched off anything it was fairly bad but nothing compared to having the bandage replaced.. aghh the memories!!

    Having said that I was delighted once the pain went away.. dunno why I felt so strongly about it back then but wouldn't change it given the chance!

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    Alicia D'amore [sign in to see picture]
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    InMe wrote:

    I had the procudure done under full anesthetic and spent 3 days in hospital afterwards and even with pain killers it hurt.. walking was uncomfortable and if it touched off anything it was fairly bad but nothing compared to having the bandage replaced.. aghh the memories!!

    And of course, your foreskin was unattached when you had it done. Babies foreskin's are attached to the skin beneath and require scraping for circumcision. Without pain relief.

    Personally I have strong feelings about circumcision on baby boys, just as I do on female circumcision on baby girls. I think it's easy to forget that the two are essentially the same, and the people practising them give the same reasons for circumcising their children.

    Adxx

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    Why do adults have it done ?As in a previous thread just keep it clean after sex wash it you know it makes sense .

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    InMe [sign in to see picture]
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    Some adults have no choice but to get it done as they simply cannot pull back their foreskin.. others like myself choose to get it done for personal reasons.. mine being I believed it would lead to a healthier sex life (no basis for comparison though) and also strongly believed it enhanced my manhood visually!

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    Pixieking [sign in to see picture]
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    In the cases of tight foreskin, it's actually entirely possible to free it in most cases without any surgical need.

    I have known two men with tight foreskins, one, it freed up in it's own time (It's not unusual for the foreskin to be tight up until the age of 18) and in the other case he just needed regular, gentle massage of the foreskin with a steroid cream.

    Skin is incredibly stretchy, and given time and patience it will stretch and heal, the same way that skin stretches when you gain weight or when you stretch a piercing.

    Circumsision to treat phimosis is only really needed as either a quick fix or whn there are othe complcations.

    I have nothing against curcimcision in and off itself. If people desire it, like in the above case, I cannot have a problem with it because they are making a choice about their own bodies. How people can alter other peoples bodies, including children, when there is no medical need is totally beyond me. I am against piercing babies ears for the same reasons. They are not old enough to concent, appriciate or indeed take care of the results.

    If people want to be circumcised, they will Choose for Themselves. If you want it for your children, why don't you ask them if they want it when they are old enough to understand what a penis is?

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    WandA [sign in to see picture]
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    Pixieking wrote:

    In the cases of tight foreskin, it's actually entirely possible to free it in most cases without any surgical need.

    I have known two men with tight foreskins, one, it freed up in it's own time (It's not unusual for the foreskin to be tight up until the age of 18) and in the other case he just needed regular, gentle massage of the foreskin with a steroid cream.

    Skin is incredibly stretchy, and given time and patience it will stretch and heal, the same way that skin stretches when you gain weight or when you stretch a piercing.

    Indeed. I've seen some absolutely massive...

    ear lobes.

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